Holy Joys Podcast
A discussion of theology and ministry practice, all for a holy, happy church. A ministry of holyjoys.org.
Holy Joys Podcast
Small Talk: Ministry, Books, and the Work of Holy Joys
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After a short break, Johnathan Arnold and David Fry get back to the podcast with a casual discussion of ministry, books, and the work of Holy Joys.
You're listening to the Holy Joys Podcast, co-hosted by Jonathan Arnold and Dr. David Fry. Visit us at holyjoys.org and stay tuned for weekly discussions of theology and ministry practice, all for a holy, happy church.
SPEAKER_01Well, it's been several weeks since we've been together to podcast. December was a busy month, as always. And holy joys, we haven't put out a lot of content here recently, but hoping to get back into the groove of things. And uh, you had a good idea to kind of reset with just a casual conversation about uh our life ministry, um, what we're reading, what we're thinking about, what's going on in the world. How was your Christmas season at the church, Advent and Christmas seasons at the church? And did you get any books for Christmas? How's your family? What's going on in your life?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, uh Advent Christmas went really well, and we uh enjoyed it as a family. Uh one of the highlights actually is uh 12th night. We always celebrate 12th night, which is the 12th day of Christmas, January uh 5th. And this year we did a little s something a little different. We took the whole family out to eat because we had received uh gift certificates. So uh the family enjoys that. Wife didn't have to cook, and then we came back and had a uh 12th night uh ritual, uh, read some uh scriptures and uh prayers, and uh and then we have a a tradition where we write on a little piece of paper, uh, we write uh what we are bringing to uh our our savior as gifts, representative of the uh the magi who brought gifts, and uh so we write it on a piece of paper and then uh we put it in our shoes. We set our shoes outside. The idea is that uh uh we are, you know, uh oh, and we put uh usually put straw in the shoes, uh, just in case camels happen to come by in the middle of the night and need uh need something to eat. Uh we've not seen camels, we've never seen reindeer. Uh uh we've never had the camels come by, but uh we do believe in camels. We don't believe in flying reindeer. Um but we uh yeah, we put that out, and then uh we put some candy in the in the shoes, the kids come back out. It's kind of like a stocking thing. Kids come out on uh on uh Epiphany morning and they they'll find some candy or they'll find some little treat. So uh that's fun. It's a fun thing. And of course, celebrated uh Advent and Christmas Sunday with the the church. Uh really, really beautiful time of gathering uh there on Christmas. I love Christmas being on on Sunday. And I think I'm gonna yeah, I think I'll I'll uh miss that for a few years. Um it really has me thinking about the possibility of having a a Christmas Day service like a Sunday service, regardless. Uh, we haven't done that, that hasn't been part of our our regular practice, but who knows?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I told Lexi after this year, I said, I just I don't think I can go another year without a Christmas Day service. And I said, we might just have to go over there to the church. And if it's just us and our family, we'll have our own little service. And uh I don't know, but yeah, that that's you know, that's what it's all about. And there's just nothing better than uh celebrating the Lord's coming on the Lord's day with the Lord's people at the Lord's table. Uh it was it was awesome. So yeah, this was a really special year for me. This was um, yeah, this was one of the most meaningful times in my my whole ministry because I had been an uh associate pastor for eight years, assistant and then associate. And where we were at, um, the church calendar wasn't you know a big priority. And uh we had made some moves towards recognizing some of the bigger uh feast days, like Pentecost and Ascension Day, but we had never really had a meaningful uh I should say we we didn't have a well-planned Advent time. And uh at our church, I talked to the the church board, they were very supportive of it. As far as I know, they had never done anything like that before here, but uh really supportive and and seemed to really enjoy it. Um we had children light the candles each week, which was special. Um and and it was it was a little more, you know, a little more um solemn and reflective as well than I than I think maybe the the church was used to. We had the lights dimmed each week during Advent and candles lit and um you know singing the Advent hymns that are a little more sub a little more uh subdued in the minor chords, and and then we had a time of prayer that was that was lament. And so it was just it was special. It was it was different. And then on Christmas Sunday, um, you know, had the lights up all the way, and the the sanctuary just had it filled with greens and decorations and lights and um you know, lit the Christ candle, and it was so encouraged. I for for weeks I had been been worried that we were gonna have a poor attendance on Christmas Day, and I was just gonna be really discouraged. And we actually had like our best attendance that I think we had in weeks, which was amazing. We had visitors in, it was just wonderful. Um and uh and then the following week, uh for the eighth day of Christmas, we we talked a little more about the incarnation and about about the Christmas celebration. So yeah, it was a wonderful time, good time as our family. We did we did an advent calendar for the first time. We'd never done that. We did that with Adam, and that was actually very meaningful. Um, we found a beautiful wooden one and had with the candy in each door a Bible verse. And so uh Adam would grab his candy, but then he'd sit right on my lap because he knew it was time to read the Bible verse. And uh we'd read that and we did a devotional and we uh prayed the glory potri and just did different things. It was just really, really special. So uh really looking forward to doing that again next year.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, to go back just um for a second to uh Christmas Sunday, we began with the lights dimmed, and we uh I read a portion of a Charles Wesley Advent hymn talking about the darkness and so forth, and then uh led into a Christmas hymn uh with scriptures, and as I as that all built, uh we had uh children with bells, and it started out with a single bell ringing coming down the aisle, and then the Christ candle came down the aisle with bells that that followed, and uh we gradually turned the lights up until we were in you know full light and the Christ candle was placed. And that was a really neat uh neat experience. First time we've done anything like that. Uh, but it was a really beautiful, beautiful experience.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, great idea. That's that's beautiful. There's so much we can do. Uh the symbolism, I think people really appreciate it. It's it just adds such richness and depth and meaning to the service. And you know, you don't have to do the same thing every year. That is one of the one of the benefits of being part of a tradition that doesn't have such a carefully prescribed liturgy. You know, the danger, though, is that then we will not put the kind of care into our service and into our liturgy that we should. And you've mentioned on various occasions that you've been putting more time into the liturgy at your church than you probably ever have in your ministry. Is that that right? Right, right, right.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and and that's developed over uh a little bit of time, but also for a few reasons. One is uh I've had you know members come to me and say, you know, hey, I really you know enjoyed that that benediction that you gave. Uh or or I've even had people say, you know, hey, I was at uh you know a church of a different tradition with family or with somebody, and they said, um, you know, they they had this element, you know, can you explain that to me? And it was really neat, but I wasn't really sure what to think of it. And I was like, oh yeah, okay, that's what this this is. And you know, this probably comes from the Book of Common Prayer. And um and people are just really tuning in to the words that are um that are used and are very intentional and relate to uh the theme of the day, the scripture passages they've been read. And so uh as people have resonated with that more so, I've realized uh, you know what, this I it's really is worth putting uh you know two to four hours a week into just preparing a written prayer, writing out the scriptures, scripture selections. I'm gonna read at the beginning of the service, as well as a call to worship, and you know, a benediction at the end, and then in the services we serve uh communion, you know, putting that that liturgy together as well. And it's also given opportunity to get other people involved, so I can have other readers read the scriptures, um, others who uh you know a different voice than my own or the other pastors. And so it's getting more people involved as well.
SPEAKER_01I was looking at the pastor's book by Kent Hughes for the first time last night. I know Travis Johnson's recommended that. There's there's books like that that are helpful for getting started. Would there be one that you would recommend or resources that pastors could look to?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, the first one, the primary one, would be the Book of Common Prayer. If you don't have a copy of that, make sure you get that. Uh, but then the uh the worship uh source book just has tons of resources in it. Uh it's by season as well. Uh so uh I use that occasionally. Uh but I would encourage someone just just begin by writing out a prayer, uh, whether it's your you know pastoral prayer at the beginning. And by the way, I usually don't um and you know I'll pray the written prayer, but then I'll I'll have some extemporaneous prayer as well. Um but uh that that's a good place to start is just have at least a portion of your prayer written and prepared, whether it's your pastoral prayer or the benediction at the end. Uh that's a really good place, and I think the simplest place to start.
SPEAKER_01Good. So Christmas, do you get any books?
SPEAKER_02Um, I did get a few books. Um I actually got them before Christmas. Uh so uh people know that I I I'll give them titles, uh, but for the most part, people say, you know, we know you like to choose your own book, so you know, here's a gift card. Uh go choose your own books. Um so I yeah, so uh most of the books that I'm that I got are well probably all of them are fairly esoteric. So I'm reading one uh by Matthew Tueninga. Uh he is a um Calvin scholar and uh really really helpful on Calvin's political theology in Geneva. Uh many people, many Wesleyan Methodists may not know this, but when it comes to political theology, uh the Wesleyan tradition uh would align pretty much point by point with uh the reformed political theology, as opposed to uh, say, Anabaptist or Lutheran uh or others. Um and uh so that's really helpful uh because uh there are some uh definite parallels with uh political theology in the Wesleyan tradition as well. So that's been really, really insightful.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we need to have a podcast on that mostly because I want to ask you some questions. So we'll have to we'll have to remember that. It'd be a great topic. And there's been a lot of talk about Christian nationalism and theopolitics uh this year. It's been a been a hot topic. So much changing and happening in our country and uh growing tensions, you know. I really think this is a time as Christians, if we haven't already, uh, we probably should have thought about these things a long time ago, but but now is the time that we really need to develop our um our approach to politics in a very theological and scriptural way. So yeah, I was really thrilled with my book haul from Christmas. I I did not expect to get any books, I just asked for some money towards some bookcases that I'm getting built. But uh I walked away with I got uh Prosper of Aquitaine's Defense of St. Augustine. I know that that's a book that was uh significant for your uh for your thesis, right? Your dissertation. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Yeah, and I got the Essential Summa Theologica uh Reader and Commentary by Bauer Schmidt. I've struggled so much to read the Summa unaided. Uh I I get partway through it, and it's just it's it's really difficult for me. And part of that is I don't have a really strong understanding of Aristotle. And this is uh I'm really I'm really excited about this. I think this is going to be really helpful for me persevering through the Summa. And then I got some books for devotional time. Uh Gregory of Nazianzas' poems on scripture. So I've been enjoying this year his uh his theological poetry. There's a volume from SBS Press. This is another volume from SBS Press that's specifically on Scripture. Uh and then I have the poems of Prudentius, which I think you read through uh maybe the same volume from the Fathers of the Church series. Oh yes. So I'm excited to dive into that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, that's a that's a beautiful book. You mentioned uh having a really difficult time uh getting into or really knowing where to start with uh Thomas Aquinas, because uh which is not unusual. Uh it's there's just a massive amount of writing that he he did. But Peter Creeft has uh written this or edited what he calls a shorter suma, and it's only it's 165 pages, and what he does is he just abridges the whole suma and puts it down to what he believes are the most important portions. Uh so someone who's wanting to get into uh Aquinas, I would definitely recommend it because then it has all of his annotations, uh speaking of Peter Krieft, uh Creef's annotations in the footnotes. And so that's really, really helpful. Um yes, it is true, it helps to know a little bit of Aristotle, but you don't have to.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I have that, and I uh was working through it last year, and uh actually realized that, and it says on the back, I just pulled it off my shelf here, that um Crieft, though though it is a book of theology, the Summa is a book of theology, there's also much philosophy, which is selected, excerpted, and arranged, introduced, and explained by Creed. So that was what I realized is when I started reading the sh a shorter Summa by Crieft, that it's primarily the philosophical portion of the of the Summa. Not that not that you can clearly discern when he's being theological, when he's being philosophical, but a lot of the theological content that I was most interested in was not in that book. And even with the footnotes, I struggled at places. I found that um Aquinas himself has a comp it's like a compendium of theology, which pulls out some of the more theological portions of the Summa, and that was helpful. Um, but I'm hoping that this is gonna be provide me with a better balance, balanced introduction to his work. So we'll see. Uh, I need to get some more guidance with with it. It's just it's intimidating. So there's a lot to cover.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah, and I would I would also recommend uh if you want the unabridged Aquinas, uh I would recommend starting with the Summa Contra Gentiles. There are I believe four or five books in that. You can get it in two volumes. Uh Summa Contra Gentiles uh is much more concise and uh same uh format as the whole Summa, but those those books are really uh much more concise and uh uh it covers uh a lot of the theological points that we'd be interested in, such as you know the nature of God. Like he has a you know pretty expansive discussion of that, and then of of humanity, doctrine of humanity as well. So those are the kind of the two big uh theological sections in at least in the first two books.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Have you seen his compendium of theology? A relatively short handbook that he wrote to explain the fundamentals of Christian doctrine to persons without training in theology. And it says scholars read the compendium for the light it can shed on the more comprehensive Summa Theologica. So that has been the most helpful thing I've I've come across yet. But yeah, I'll have to check out that uh Summa Contra Gentiles, too.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so you mentioned that Christian nationalism has been uh back in conversation. Uh that has been helped in part by a book that came out, I believe, in 2021, maybe even, yeah, or sorry, 2022 by Stephen Wolfe. And I know has gained uh some some notoriety. Um I have not read the book. I know a little bit about Stephen Wolf, and I know the perspective he's coming from. So I already have um low expectations. Uh, but there are some YouTube videos out there of him talking about the book and his thesis. And just from those, uh number one, I there were no surprises uh to me when I heard him lecture on it. And uh secondly, um I think it is quite simplistic in its thesis.
SPEAKER_01You had one time, I think, charted out maybe four or five uh broad views of political theology. Where would you place that book in relationship to other views? I mean, would that be some kind of like dominion theology?
SPEAKER_02Uh certainly it's it's in in the sphere of Dominion theology. Um and I would say this, I I really don't think that too many scholars, if any, are going to take the book very seriously. Um, I don't think it's gonna get a lot of attention from even conservative academics. Uh it may get some, but it's not gonna get a lot. But I have had some people, you know, some thinking people say, Hey, have you familiar with this book? I'm seeing it advertised a lot. Have you read it? And you know, my response is, well, no, I haven't. I do intend to at some point, but uh here's what I know. Uh but yeah, it's it's definitely within the Dominion theology. So basically it is the thesis. His version of Christian theism, or I'm sorry, Christian um nationalism is that uh our civil government ought to be operated as according to uh the Christian faith and that uh distinctly Christian rules or laws ought to be enforced by the government. Uh so it is really uh I mean the obvious problem is is that he is surrendering authority that's been given to the church to the state. I mean he's he's essentially asking, advocating that the state take over what has been entrusted to this to the church.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we need to have a whole conversation on that. There's so many different directions we could go. Why don't we uh why don't we shift gears here? We only have a couple minutes left. We're gonna cut this off right around the 30-minute mark. Um uh but yeah, let me uh just ask you, what are you preaching? Uh I'm sure through Ad Bat and Christmas, you know, you had sermons, but now that we're back into the new year, where where are you heading? Are you um you starting another series or just uh picking up with the uh lectionary for a while? Curious where you're headed now.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm following the lectionary right now while I am preparing for uh two upcoming series. Uh one will be this year and another will probably be next year. Uh but the one that I'm hoping to get started on sooner or this year is on Sabbath, uh, which is another theological topic that has come up frequently in broader conversations. And then uh I'm also working on a series through uh the epistles of Peter with a focus on a theology of suffering.
SPEAKER_01Excellent. Yeah, I preached uh Through First Peter, where I pastored previously, uh, I think it was back in 2015, and I focused on uh suffering and Christian Christian witness uh in suffering. And man, it was it was really formative for me. It would it was really form I so I, you know, I I came from a family that's very, very politically involved and active, which which isn't always a you know necessarily a bad thing, but um I yeah, I don't I definitely before that time had not seriously considered my approach to politics in light of scripture. And that was the beginning of my journey to tie it back to what you were just talking about here. Uh 1 Peter, that was really the I looked to that time, and I actually I actually had to um I remember that was personally spiritually formative because I had to um actually ask my wife for forgiveness for some some ways in which I had been um too forceful with my own approach to politics in in contrast to to her approach to politics. And uh that just really, really made me do some soul searching. So I'm excited to see, I'm excited to see um what you do there and and hear some of those sermons and and also uh on Sabbath, because we've talked about that a lot with our friend John Earls and others. And there's just a there's just a lot to unpack there, and and not always, I don't think we thought really carefully about about Sabbath and sometimes assume some things that that are difficult to um, especially in light of Christian history, you know, really difficult to establish. So so curious to see where you go with that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so I've been reading uh several books on Sabbath uh in preparation for that series. Uh the one I'm reading now is by Norman Weirsba, Living the Sabbath, discovering the rhythms of rest and delight. I've just just started it, so I'm not too far into it, but I've been enjoying it so far. Uh but uh you know, another, I think, must read on this topic would be uh an older book edited by D.A. Carson called uh From Sabbath to Lord's Day. And of course, they take the position. It's a you know number of authors, well-known you know, theologians, who agree that uh Sunday is not the Sabbath. It's the Lord's Day, but not the Sabbath. Uh so that's a that's a view that I did not grow up with. Um I don't know that's a view I hold now, but you know, these are very well-known and respected uh evangelical theologians. So I'll I'll give them a careful read and see what they're saying. Uh and then of course I have some books that would argue otherwise. Um so it's it's gonna be it's gonna be something that is uh gonna be a real learning experience for me because quite frankly, as I have been exposed to some of the other views of Sabbath, um I've I've found myself being a little less dogmatic and yet not completely convinced of other views. So we'll see. We'll see how that goes. I'm trying to be careful and and of course follow scripture as best I can.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, uh that's exactly where I'm at. Uh and and I this is a really important issue to me because it's it's this investigating this issue is one of the reasons why I'm a Christian. Uh so I in uh public high school, I was kind of very nominally Christian at best, and I started dating a Seventh-day Adventist girl, started going to church uh with her on Saturdays, and was going to uh mostly because of because I cared about her, not because I cared about the Sabbath. I was going to take off work on Saturdays to start going to church every week with her. And my parents were like, whoa, you know, no, like Sunday is the the Sabbath. And uh that that really forced me. That was like the first issue that I ever really investigated, and that was kind of a gateway into Christianity um as a whole. Uh, but I got a hold of the book that I think it's edited by I can't think of who Four Views. Is it a Zondervin book book, Four Views on the Sabbath? One of the first books, Christian books I ever uh bought. Joseph Pippa, or is it Pippa, that defends the the Lord Christian Sabbath view, that the Lord's Day is the Sabbath. Uh he's a Presbyterian, I believe. Uh, but then there, you know, there were other views in that book. And uh yeah, so just really curious to see where you come out. But I I was also kind of broke my teeth on uh well, that's not the right expression. I don't know how what that cut my teeth. Hopefully I didn't break my teeth. I cut my teeth on the uh Westminster Shorter Catechism. Uh and of course, you know, Presbyterian again, very strong uh Christian Sabbath view. And so I was, you know, kind of strong, dogmatic on this. And then as I began to study church history and other views, it really softened me. So still not convinced by the fulfillment view that Jesus fulfills the Sabbath, and so that commandment isn't binding on us in in any way as far as a day of rest goes. I'm not convinced by those views, but it has definitely softened me in respect to others.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah, I think I mean there are some views that are so hard to digest, you probably would break your teeth on them, but there's I think there are at least a couple of views I think are um you know really tenable and and cannot be quickly dismissed. And and I would say that there are at least a couple of views that have you know long currency, have been around for quite a while within our own tradition, Methodist tradition. So uh you know, to this day, it continues to be a debate. I actually I don't know what next year's uh Aldersgate Forum topic is yet. I don't think they've announced that, but I my suggestion uh was this topic, uh the Sabbath. So uh hopefully, if not next year sometime soon uh that will happen.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, very cool. That would be great. Okay, the only other thing that I think we were gonna talk about here is just quickly uh recap the Ministry of Holy Joys uh last year, what we did, uh where we're heading. So why don't we just end with that? Um boy, I tell you, the year seems like a blur. Uh we, you know, we obviously continued to publish uh new articles. I uh we didn't put out as much, uh as many articles as I would have liked, but we did work on some other big projects that I'm really excited about. Um, of course, the kids catechism we've talked about before. I just heard back from the printers, and they should be shipping those the 27th, so a little bit later than expected, anticipated, but those will be in hand very soon. And uh I just recently created a board game, a catechism board game to go with that, and we've been playing it as a family, and Adam loves it. And uh Lexi said she actually has been really enjoying it, and we're learning the catechism, both that catechism and an adult catechism that we've been using uh super quick uh playing that game. So I'm I'm thinking it's gonna be a fun way for parents to engage kids, and we'll we'll be coming out with that at some point, releasing that uh for people to buy. And then we've been uh working on the next catechism, and we had we had planned to do a shorter and a larger. Uh we still need to think through this, but I'm almost leaning towards um, you know, just making this this first catechism be more comprehensive, have more resources, more appendices, more room for growth, and then maybe come out with supplementary, uh like short little books, kind of like those nine marks books uh on key topics to use for classes and curriculum. And we'll just have to work through what we want to do there. But this upcoming project is gonna be the largest project um that I've ever done, certainly Holy Joys that we've done. And uh it's it's something that I've been slowly working on and have had a heart to do for years now. It will be another 52 question catechism, but it'll be for um for adults or for older children. And there will be explanatory footnotes. Um, we're drawing heavily from the Articles of Religion and Wesley's revision of the Westminster Shorter Catechism. Uh, it'll be broken down into six subsections for use with a six-week baptism and church membership class. Uh, it's something that I plan to use in in our weekly worship as part of our worship, asking catechism questions to the whole congregation and reading those responsively. Um, and then there's going to be a ton of resources for discipleship, spiritual formation, uh, outlines for daily devotions that start really basic for new believers and then work your way up all the way to the order for morning and evening prayer from Wesley's Sunday service, which is drawn from the BCP. There's Bible reading plans, there's um various prayers and scriptures for various needs, there's inductive Bible studies, there's um the creeds, uh recommended reading, Christian spiritual classics, uh the collects uh for each Sunday of the church year, just so many resources here that's gonna provide really a comprehensive, almost discipleship handbook, uh, even having rites for baptism, the Lord's Supper, uh for marriage and burial. Uh question, I actually was just thinking about maybe including here some questions for premarital counseling. We have questions for baptism and membership interview. So this is gonna be really our big work. And the other resources that we produce will be supplementary, will be kind of uh you can branch off from this into other resources that we produce. So this is gonna be my focus this year is just on getting this print ready and are really excited with what we're doing there.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah, yeah. We've had a lot of good conversations, you know, obviously private conversations about you know, about the particularly about the catechism and but the contents as well. And I think that's gonna be a tremendous help and resource really for first for discipleship, but then also as a uh resource for pastors who are wanting to put uh some more thought into uh the Sunday service. And uh we talked a little bit about that earlier. And this is gonna have uh I think the best from our own tradition all in one place, and it's uh I think it's gonna be a real blessing. I I am very, very excited about uh having it and making it available uh to our own people.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I don't know, maybe some of it's my personality, but the other thing Oh, go ahead. Sorry, that was one of those times. Go ahead.
SPEAKER_02All right. Uh I was gonna switch gears just a little bit to the I was gonna switch gears just a little bit to the uh sermon, uh Wesley's sermon that we were editing. But go ahead if you're gonna stay on this.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, make one quick comment. Um there's been so many times in my ministry where I have wanted something like the Book of Common Prayer. And I I do use the Book of Common Prayer uh when I take communion to the sick or whatever. I'll I'll use uh I'll just take the Book of Common Prayer with me. Um, but the Book of Common Prayer, the the rites are really long. They're uh the language is difficult for people who are unaccustomed to that kind of liturgy. And Wesley's Sunday service uh begins with an introduction where Wesley says that people have long complained about the length and that he's abridged some things. And so this is kind of uh an abridgment of Wesley's abridgment. So we're we're using a lot of content out of the Sunday service, and it provides pastors with some flexible rights as well that it gives some instructions for how to adapt this to use this in a flexible way. But I'm just excited about this for my own ministry because I want kind of a one-stop shop. I want a book that I can grab with me and I can take uh into Sunday worship, go visit the sick, go, you know, go to a funeral, go oversee a wedding, whatever. And it's one book. It has every all the core essentials that I need. And I don't have to constantly be, you know, printing out rights and putting them in my binder and just trying to constantly be figuring out what am I gonna do. Uh, it just gives me a standard uh to fall back on. And so I'm really hoping that pastors will pick this up and use it. Like the Book of Common Prayer is used, you know, in Anglican churches today. It'll be it'll be that kind of a handbook, a resource that you you keep with your Bible, you know, and you take with you everywhere you go.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, the other thing that we are working on, uh I've started actually adding my own annotations to John Wesley's sermon, uh, The Duty of Constant Communion. And I think we have talked about the idea of uh uh Holy Joy's publishing, uh republishing some of Wesley's uh sermons that are especially uh thematic that would be useful for discipleship as well. Uh this would be one, uh the duty of constant communion, and would contain again some appendices and other resources uh in the back uh with our annotations on the sermon that could be used as you know a class, again, a you know, six-week class if someone wanted to do that, or a Sunday school class uh for discipleship, uh even as a resource for uh training uh your members and and your leaders for understanding uh the meaning and significance of uh frequent uh communion and how that relates to uh the responsibilities of the church, particularly in regard to church discipline. So uh I'm very excited about that. I have uh started uh again writing out my annotations and uh we'll be giving some more attention to that this year, too. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01No, I'm really looking forward to that, and I want to include in the appendices some of the Wesley's hymns on the Lord's Supper. So one of the one of the most exciting things that I discovered this year is that John and Charles Wesley published an entire hymnal with just hymns devoted to the Lord's Supper. I just couldn't already believe it. How I've never heard about this. Um, but we're talking about uh 166 hymns on the Lord's Supper. And uh I read through these and used some of these in my Christmas sermon, and just so rich, so beautiful. I had preached a series uh for Advent on waiting for a prophet, priest, and king, and waiting for a prophet like Moses, a priest like Melchizedek, a king like David. And so, you know, we get to Christmas, which literally Christ Christ Mass, the Lord's Supper on Christ Day. And my message was, you know, we've been waiting on a prophet, priest, and king. The prophet, priest, and king has come today. The only thing left for us to do is to participate in his work. And the way we participate, my sermon text was, you know, is not the bread that we break, a participation. Um, so then I used all these Wesley hymns, uh, and and they talk about this. So they talk about how Aaron and Melchizedek, you know, meet us at the table, our greater Melchizedek, and he brings the bread and wine to the church uh as Melchizedek brought the bread and wine to Abraham. You know, all this rich typology. So just uh a great testimony to the centrality of the Lord's Supper in the ministry of the Wesleys. And uh also reading the Sunday service in the introduction, Wesley mentions the Lord's Supper like three times in the short five or six paragraph introduction. He says uh to justify his ordination of elders, he says the reason why I've got to do this, basically the reason for the existence of the first Methodist denomination in America, is that there's no one to administer baptism in the Lord's Supper for a hundred miles around. Um, he goes on to say that Methodist elders should administer the Lord's Supper every Lord's day. It's right there in the Sunday service. So just a crucial part uh of the the Wesley's ministry. Spread scriptural holiness, administer the Lord's Supper, uh, administer the sacraments, just to just go hand in hand, can't separate the two.
SPEAKER_02Right, right. So I think this resource will uh really give an explanation for why the Lord's Supper is central to uh and even constitutive of the church, and uh will answer a lot of the frequently asked questions.
SPEAKER_01Looking forward to a great year ahead, and uh hopefully Holy Joys continues to be a resource that is helping churches, uh pastors, lay people to be more holy and happy.
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